foreign perspectives
Gay Life in a Perverse
This interview, v/hich took place
earlier this year in Bonn, represents
the opinions and individual perspective
of one gay German, Dieter, a computer
scientist who lives in Bonn. Re came
to Bonn as a student 13 years ago, be---
longs to the West German ecological
group Die Grunen, and supports the
feminist movement and autonomy for the
workers.
Are there any gay/lesbian groups in
Bonn ?
Yes, one that was founded in 1974 by
seven people, myself included, who were
almost all students then. We felt that
we could get a group going, that we
should do it, and that it would work.
One special impetus was a movie by Rosa
van Praunheim called Nicht der Homo-
sexuelle ist preverse, sondern die
Gfccellschaft in der er lebt (loosely
translated: Society is perverse, not
homosexuality). The movie showed how
gay people live together, how they act
and behave. It was professionally made
but presented in a kitschy manner which
was the.correct style for the film be
cause gay people act kitschily some
times. The central message was that
gays should come out of the bars, out of
the toilets, and be proud of being gay
and publish your gayness. Gay people
were doing just that. The time seemed
right then, and it was the last of a se
quence of movements begun in the late
60s to get going.
What were the group’s goals?
Helping people who were coming out
and trying to repeal the law §175, which
had been the same since 1933. Homosex
ual relations between people under 21
were illegal and punishable by imprison
ment .
What specifically was done for people
coming out?
We organized a room and held weekly
meetings, wrote newspapers, had a tele
phone line. There were 20-30 people in
the group in the beginning.
Were you successful in helping people
come out?
In a very limited way, yes. Especial
ly, I suppose, in regard to the number
of people. Perhaps 300-400 people have
gone through the group since it began.
Were there any attempts to make Bonn
aware of homosexuality?
Four times a year we held a booth in
the central market-place where we dis
tributed a pamphlet asserting that gay
people are as ’’normal’* as straight peo
ple and that §175 should be repealed.
Wiiat else was done to repeal §175
Besides writing letters to the repre
sentatives in parliament as a group, we
tried to collect all the other gay groups
into one organization that held yearly
meetings and sponsored marches and de
monstrations when the groups met. Per
haps 300 people would march. Other
demonstrations were held on Christopher
Street Day or during Stonewall week in
Bremen or Berlin or Hamburg.
Is §175 still on the books?
No, it was changed a little bit to
lower the age to 18, but of course it. is
a restriction for homosexuals only. The
age for heterosexuals is 16. Another
difference is that if a man has a rela-
tionsliip with a girl under 16, the par
ents or someone else have the responsi
bility to prosecute. If a man, however,
has a relationship with a boy under 18,
the state has to persecute.
What anti-homosexual laws are prosecuted?
Well, whenever the government has
knowledge of such a situation, they
prosecute.
How do they find out?
If a 17-year-old boy tells a teacher,
the teacher goes to the police. This
happens a lot.
But what about prosecution against adult
homosexuals?
Normally, there's not any. The police
do have mirrors behind the toilets or
they take pictures (in Hamburg, for
example). If they know the identity of
the person, they put them down on the
lists they keep of known homosexuals.
In some towns there are lists called
Rosalisten (Pink Lists) of the known
homosexuals. They never arrest them for
having sex in the bathroom. They can’t
unless one is underage. You can’t pro
test against the list. Some employers
keep lists also. I-Jl^en a known homo
sexual leaves a firm and changes jobs,
the new factory receives his recommenda
tion and there are special phrases or
sentences that indicate that the person
is homosexual.
Can a gay person go to the police and
see if his name is on a list?
No. People have tried, but they were
told they could have no information
about secret documents. No one knows
who does see these lists. If someone
wants to be a teacher, the school asks
for information and usually receives
it.
How else do they get names for the list?
Occasionally a large number of police
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