10The Daily Tar HeelMonday, April 21, 1886
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New process, new resii
Saturday was a first for the annual
doling out of student fees known as the
budget process. Except for lengthy
debate over the budget of the Carolina
Gay and Lesbian Association, the
Student Congress followed its timetable
of approving budgets for 29 groups in
10 hours. The scaled-down, less subjec
tive budget process apparently left more
student groups satisfied, gave student
legislators a better format and left a
surplus of $10,498 for subsequent
appropriations in the coming year.
This is not to say the process was
without controversy. The CGLA debate
covered four long hours of discussion
pitting the proponents of CGLA fund
ing, who basically argued that the
organization plays a viable role in
educating students and serving a large
campus minority, and funding oppo
nents, who substantiated their views
mainly with polls of constituencies or
personal moral beliefs.
Fortunately, the proponents won.
Much to the chagrin of campus hom
ophobes, the CGLA does increase
student awareness of discomforts society
inflicts on the gay community and it does
inform students on health matters.
Anti-gay sentiments were not nearly
so evident this year as in past years;
rather, some opponents adopted more
objective lines of reasoning. A poll of
constituents by Jody Beasley, Rob
Friedman and Lori Taylor, whose
Fritz Graebe's helping hand
Adolf Hitler, had he lived, would have
been 97 Sunday. Herman "Fritz"
Graebe, a much nobler but lesser-known
German, should be so remembered 12
years from now.
Graebe, who died last week in San
Francisco at age 85, was the antithesis
of Hitler. The Holocaust of Nazi
Germany sickened him, and he was
determined, in his own small but
courageous way, to help the plight of
German Jewry. After the war, Graebe,
who was as compassionate as the
Gestapo was ruthless, provided the
postwar world much-needed, firsthand
accounts of perhaps the century's biggest
horror story, the systematic slaughter of
six million innocent people.
In 1942, serving as a civil engineer for
the German occupational forces in the
Ukraine, Graebe eventually came to
believe what he had long denied: that
the Nazis' program of uncompromising
nationalism included the extermination
of the country's Jews. He witnessed
many atrocities but, to his sorrow, could
do little to stop them.
Graebe secretly established a rescue
network among the Nazis, who, he said,
"were drunk with killing." He hired
hundreds of Jewish workers and gal
lantly fought to keep many of them from
being "transferred" actually a euphe
mism for "killed." He provided false
identification for some and helped others
The Daily Tar Heel
Editorial Writers: Ed Brackett, Tom Camp and Dewey Messer
Editorial Assistant: Nicki Weisensee
Layout: Heather Brown. Laura Grimmer, Jean Lutes and Laura Rector
News: Jenny Albright, Lisa Allen. Andrea Beam, Rick Beasley. Helene Cooper, Vicki Daughtry. Michelle
Efird, Jennifer Essen, Jeannie Faris, Jo Fleischer, Matthew Fury. Todd Gossett, Scott Greig. Mike
Gunzenhauser, Maria Haren, Nancy Harrington, Suzanne Jeffries. Dcnise Johnson. Teresa Kriegsman.
Scott Larsen, Alicia Lassiter, Donna Leinwand, Mitra Lotfi, Jackie Leach, Brian Long, Guy Lucas.
Jean Lutes, Karen McManis, Laurie Martin, Smithson Mills. Toby Moore. Yvette Denise Moultrie.
Kathy Nanney, Felisa Neuringer, Rachel Orr, Gordon Rankin, Liz Saylor, Valerie Stegall. Rachel Stiffler.
Joy Thompson, Elisa Turner, Laurie Willis and Bruce Wood. Linda Montanari. assistant city editor.
Kelly Hobson, Marie Thompson, Eric Whittington and Skip Williams, wire editors.
Sports: Tim Crothers, James Surowiecki and Bob Young, assistant sports editors. Mike Berardino.
Greg Cook, Phyllis Fair, Phil Gitelman, Paris Goodnight, Louise Hines, Lorna Khalil, Mike Mackay.
Tom Morris, Kathy Mulvey, Lee Roberts, Wendy Stringfellow and Buffie Velliquette. Bill DiPaolo
and Greg Humphreys, sports cartoonists.
Features: Elcni Chamis, KeUy Clark, Kara V. Donaldson. Tracy Hill. Shirley Hunter. Kathy Peters.
Jeanie Mamo, Sharon Sheridan. Martha Wallace and Susan Wood.
Arts: James Burrus, Mark Davis, Mary Hamilton, Aniket Majumdar, Alexandra Mann. Alan Mason.
Mark Mattox, Rob Sherman and Ian Williams.
Photography: Charlotte Cannon, Larry Childress. Jamie Cobb and Janet Jarman.
Copy Editors: Roy Greene, assistant news editor. Karen Anderson. Jennifer Cox. Carmen Graham.
Tracy Hill, Lisa Lorentz, Toni Shipman and Joy Thompson.
Editorial Cartoonists: Adam Cohen, Bill Cokas and Trip Park.
Business and Advertising: Anne uchcr,managing director: Paula Brewer, advertising director: Mary
I'earse, advertising coordinator. Angela Booze, student business manager: Angela Ostwalt, accounts
receivable clerk- Doug Robinson, student advertising manager: Alicia Brady, Keith Childers, Eve Davis,
Staci Ferguson Kellie McElhaney, Melanie Parlier and Scott Whitaker, advertising representatives:
Staci Ferguson, Kelly Johnson and Rob Patton, classified advertising clerks: David Leff. office manager
and Cathy Davis, secretary.
Distributioncirculation: William Austin, manager; Tucker Stevens, circulation assistant.
Production: Brenda Moore and Stacy Wynn. Rita Galloway and Rose Lee. production assistants.
Printing: Hinton Press Inc. ol Mebanc
IM Z(XK, i
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Stuart Tonkinson. Associate vJitor
Grant Parsons, University Editor
Bryan Gatus, nvws Editor
Kl-RSTIN COYLU, City Editor
Jll.L GLRBLR. State and National 'Editor
Scott Fowler, sports Editor
DLNISL SMITHURMAN. Features Editor
ROBERT KEEP!:, Business Editor
Elizabeth Ellen, a ns Edit or
Dan Chariton, Photography Editor
district includes students in Morrison,
Hinton James and Craige, showed 68
percent opposition to the CGLA fund
ing. The threesome said they would vote
accordingly, two for and one against.
But Student Body President Bryan
Hassel, noting that student sentiment
opposed the admission of black students
to UNC in the late '50s, said that the
vision of those willing to persevere
through adverse times ensure a progres
sive society. The vision of gay leaders
and those sympathetic to the gay cause
will minimize ostracism and oppression.
One aspect of the debate, however,
showed use of a double standard.
Constituents' views were applied only in
the CGLA debate. While some congress
members honestly adopted the delegate
approach to representation, Hassel
rightfully attributed the use of such
reasoning by some to a veiled discrim
ination of gays. These representatives are
the very students CGLA programming
targets. Such bigotry can only be
attacked head-on through organiza
tions such as the CGLA.
Regardless, Student Body Treasurer
John Williams deemed the day a success,
noting that only four of 30 groups sought
changes from the budgets recommended
by the congress' finance committee.
Comparing this year's budget process to
past ones, especially considering the
hefty surplus, the Student Congress
deserves to be congratuled.
receive heeded medicine.
Once, when 100 of his workers were
threatened with "transfer," Graebe
protested to the commanding officer.
The confrontation erupted into a shout
ing match. The officer drew a gun;
Graebe did the same. After a moment
of silence, the officer relented, telling
Graebe to "go get the rest of your Jews,
take them with you and leave."
Graebe was the only German citizen
brave enough to testify for the prose
cution at the Nuremberg trials. His
accounts of the Holocaust "brought a
hush of horror" to the courtroom, one
journalist wrote.
For Graebe, life in his homeland was
never as easygoing as before. After
Nuremberg, he began receiving death
threats. Blacklisted by the German
business community, he was unable to
start his own business.
He and his wife, Elisabeth, moved to
the United States in 1948 and opened
a construction company, which he
headed until retirement at 80. In 1965,
Israel gave its highest honors to Graebe
in a ceremony at Jerusalem's Holocaust
center.
Now Fritz Graebe, like Adolf Hitler,
Nazi Germany, the Holocaust and
World War II, is but a memory. But
Graebe who he was and what he did
represents a pleasant memory; his
name should continue to demand the
respect his memory deserves.
B TM - tot r
Editor s note: The following are excerpts from
an interview of UNC system President CD.
Spongier Jr. conducted last week by DTH Editor
Jim Zook and Associate Editor Stuart Tonkin
son. Photographs by Larry Childress.
DTH: What are some of the specific goals you
have set for yourself as president?
Spangler: The purpose of a university is not
necessarily just to instill knowledge, but also to
create a situation where students develop the
ability to cope with the changes they are going
to face. In the past things didn't change very
rapidly we don't see that any more. Things
are very much on the move now. Jobs that people
have now might not be around 15 years from
now. So students have to learn how to do new
jobs, how to cope with changes without having
stress in their lives.
DTH: There was a lot of speculation during
the presidential selection process that the new
president would have a lot to contend with in
following President William C. Friday. Have you
found that difficult?
Spangler: Everybody pretty much said it was
going to be difficult to follow Mr. Friday. As
well meaning as those people were, 1 don't think
they were giving him full credit. I would have
rather followed Mr. Friday than any other person
I know, simply because he had done so well.
... He built support for the University among
the faculty. He built support for the University
in the General Assembly. He built support for
the University with the alumni. He built support
all across the state, and when he left, he didn't
take that with him.
DTH: What would you say is the main group
that benefits from the existence of the University?
Does the University exist to serve the students,
to serve the state, or some other group?
Spangler: . . . The University is here for only
one reason and that is to offer an education to
the students. It is the historic belief . . . that the
University is the training ground for leadership
that the state is going to need in the future. As
far as Chapel Hill is concerned they've been
training leaders for the state since 1795. Of
course, the other universities are younger, but
they're not that much younger. N.C. State will
be 100 years old next year, and it has trained
a great number of leaders.
DTH: Something that has received a lot of
attention lately is federal financial aid and the
effects of Gramm-Rudman. What can the system
administration do to try to counter these effects,
or should this be something the individual
campuses should handle?
Spangler: ... The adverse effects of the . . .
program should be talked about as much as
possible. It is my job to make that known . . .
The administration's policy of changing the
financial aid to students could result, if adopted,
in more than a million students . . . being taken
out of college next year. Now, Congress has a
good grip on this, and that's not going to happen.
But the reduction of the Pell Grants would be
a severe, severe blow to the students of the
universities across the nation, and we would be
no different.
DTH: So how do the universities work to
counter these effects?
Spangler: First is to say that the president is
wrong in trying to reduce financial aid to
students, that he is wrong in trying to reduce
research grants to universities. These are places
where the future of the nation rests. There is
no question that he can save money next year
and the following year in reducing those
expenditures. But in the long term, it is going
to severely injure the nation. He is talking about
complex defense mechanisms . . . You have to
have people to design them, you have to have
people to build them, you have to have people
to repair them, and that's going to take college
level people. You can't cut back on the college
level people without injuring the national
security. We saw this in the pre-Sputnik situation
in 1957. Then, the federal government got awfully
serious in teaching physics and chemistry and
math and science in the colleges. We don't want
to have to do that again. It seems to me we've
got those assets, and we shouldn't let them
dwindle.
DTH: What other issues do you hope to
express your opinion on Pell Grants, minority
recruitment, for example?
Spangler: Well, first is not to let anything
happen to the Pell Grants. Second is to try to
show support for research. Admittedly, those are
things that you benefit from in the future. We're
investing in 10. 20, 30 years in those things that
are needed. So, I'd be talking about that. . . .
It's important that we don't lose our momentum
in recruiting minorities. That now is no longer
receiving the attention that it merits. The
University of North Carolina is not in any way
reducing its efforts it has strengthened them
" for good reasons. But I think nationally that's
not the case.
DTH: Something that has been a major story
in Chapel Hill the last couple of weeks has had
to do with the shanties outside South Building
and student activism. What do you think of all
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the student activism when looking at the situation
here as opposed to how it was handled at
Berkeley?
Spangler: Our 16 chancellors got together and
talked about these matters last month. 1 asked
Chancellor Fordham to describe what had
happened and what his approach had been in
regard to the shanties being built on the campus.
Chancellor Fordham talked to the other
chancellors and to our vice presidents about this
and then we discussed what were the factors
involved so that the chancellors would be able
to meet the responsibilites of their individual
institutions. The discussion was a very good
discussion. Chancellor Fordham talked about the
very important right on a university's campus
for the freedom of expression and we talked
about the difference between freedom of speech
and freedom of expression. We talked about
whether the shanties represented freedom of
expression or whether or not that was reserved
only for verbal expression. We talked about
where they were to be placed. For instance, if
they had been placed at the entrance to the
emergency room to the hospital they would not
have been allowed to be put there. The students,
obviously, have good intent and would not have
taken that approach. That's an indication of their
understanding of their responsibilities, even in
wishing to dissent on the matter.
The students acted, as far as we are able to
determine, with responsibility and care in a way
that made a maximum impact for their state
ment. If they had done otherwise, it would not
have helped their purpose. The discussion
centered on the fact that on a university campus,
you hope to have freedom of expression, and
when you don't have that you don't have the
kind of campus you would wish to have. You
obviously would not want to wish for violence
we had no violence. We would not wish for
harshness we did not have that, we had
considerate people on all sides. There were some
strong positions, which are justified, but the
actual building of the shanties was done by people
who care. Chancellor Fordam, I thought,
acquitted himself very well in his communica
tions with the students and 1 think students did
just as well as he did. Freedom of expression
is important, whether you agree with the position
taken or not. One of the chancellors mentioned
that he was in agreement with the students, but
we all agree that wasn't the most significant
circumstance. It is not that the chancellors or
the trustees are against apartheid I would say
that's a unanimous position, that they're against
apartheid but they are for freedom of
expression, and that was the reason the students
were allowed to have shanties there, because of
the fact that it was a freedom-of-expression issue.
That's a big difference now, you have to face
the fact that thereH be issues that you don't agree
with. For instance, what would we feel if someone
had said that we represent a group and that we
want to have burning crosses on our campus
as our freedom of expression? That gets to be
a problem. But there's an element there that has
to be considered. When does it cross the line?
DTH: We've talked about what role the
University plays within the state and the
responsibility of the University in providing an
education for the students. Do you see any
corresponding responsibility of the student to the
Univesity and to the state? What would you
counsel a student entering the University to try
to achieve?
Spangler: There's no question that the students
have responsibilities, very strong responsibilities.
The student has a responsibility to abide by the
laws. The student has a moral responsibility to
make an effort, an , honest effort to get an
education and not waste the resources that the
people who pay taxes in the state have provided
for us. The student doesn't have the right to waste
resources . . . The student also obviously has to
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learn to live in a community, which this is . .
The long-term responsibilities include to be a
good citizen of where they live, and I think most
of them would be right here in North Carolina.
Those responsibilities are no different from what
their parents had, or their grandparents, and!
those responsibilities aren't going to change in
the next 100 years.
DTH: Probably the main decision you've made
thus far is with the appointment of Dr. Robinson
as a new vice president. In bringing him in, do
you view the University as an enlarged version
of the K-12 setup? If he s going to be the
legislative liaison, that's a big step for him to
make from superintendent of one county to j
relating to people and interests of 100 counties.
Spangler: Education in North Carolina begins
primarily in kindergarten and it ends, formally,
when a person leaves graduate school. 1 don't
see there being a natural wall between primary,
secondary and what s called higher education.
It has to fit together well, or the student won't
have maximum benefits . . . Now a freshman
is not a senior in high school. They're still
students and they're still seeking the same general
goal a good education.
DTH: One of the current controversies on this
campus is the number of out-of-state students
who should be admitted to the University.
Faculty members have expressed a desire that
that number be increased to about 20-25 percent.
The Board of Trustees had originally planned
for only 15 percent into this campus and later
raised that figure to 18 percent. What is your
opinion as to the number of out-of-staters who
should be admitted to this University?
Spangler: The Board of Governors established
that as 18 percent. The Board of Governors are
my bosses. I think it's a reasonable position that
many people have that out-of-state students bring
to the campus a dulerence of viewpoints and
backgrounds, and that strengthens the educa
tional process. 1 believe that. I also know that
the University has been paid for by North
Carolinians who expect their children to have
an opportunity to come to one of these instititions
that they support. It does seem to me a pretty
reasonable percentage.
DTH: Do you and President Friday keep in
very close touch?
Spangler: Yes. President Friday has been an
outstanding president of this university and he
has told me that he was available at any time
to give me background information about
subjects which were of importance to the
University. He has met with me very frequently
when 1 needed to know about an issue. He does
not try to make the decisions about an issue
because he is not that kind of person. But he
is very helpful in bringing to the front those
factors which made the University strong in the
past. -
DTH: In the coming few years, there's going
to be some changes with some of the chancellors
on the state campuses be it for retirement
age or for some other reason. What criteria do
you use in choosing a new chancellor? Do you
see yourself as a chief executive officer, or do
you see yourself as treating it like a federal
government system, overseeing the individual
campuses like states operating separately?
Spangler: The laws of North Carolina are very
clear. There's one president and he's the chief
executive officer. That's by law. The chancellors
and the boards of trustees at the individual
institutions have some powers that are delegated
by the Board of Governors and by the president.
That's not within the authority of the president
to alter.
DTH: Could you describe some of the day-
to-day responsibilities of the president?
Spangler: It's a combination of formal and
informal duties. There are the various vice
presidents with whom you meet, generally in the
morning, either together or individually, and
discuss what is going on in their fields, such as
academic affairs and financial affairs. There are
happenings in student affairs: for instance, the
disturbance over at North Carolina Central, and
you want to know what's going on over there
that day, what they've done about it. You want
to know what happened at that hazing incident
a couple days ago. You want information, not
to make a decision that's the chancellor's job
but to be aware of the stresses that the
chancellors are undergoing. If there is any help
you can offer the chancellor, you just pick up
the phone and call on an informal basis. You
obviously get a lot of mail, and you get people
who want the University to do things, and you
listen to them. The basic purpose of the president
is to plan for the future, and you would not
wish that the details of the day would push out
the opportunity to think about what's going to
happen five or 10 years Irom now.
DTH: This is early in your tenure, but looking
down the road when your time is up, what do
you hope to look back and see that you've done?
Spangler: Recognizing the thousands on top
of thousands of people who've said it's going
to be hard to replace Mr. Friday, 1 hope there
will be somebody to say it's going to be hard
to replace Dick Spangler.