Thursdoy, June 20, 1977
A Conversation With Walter Pinchbeck
editors NOTl! This convetSQlfon was recorded by Professor ^ ^ ^ .
M,. Wolter Pinchbeck, o beloved member of our communm, w! reorin? r^
Mr. Woher Pinchbeck, O'genHe ond coring mon who conldb,^ mtehShr^r^ “ °
boys"Tyho scouted wkh him. Professor EHodes b o hbforv nrote* 1° *he character of hb
co-author of The Only Load I Know °of Pembroke Stole University
Ibdinns, The ortlde appeored oilginolly In Pen?brake Mogoilne,
DAVID K. ELIADES
A CONVERSATION WITH WALTER PINCHBECK
In our conversation Walter Pinchbeck remarked at the start that he was “a
common man, not well-educated, an unexceptional man,” Nothing could be
farther from the truth. Mr. Pinchbeck's life has been one of adventure and
accomplishment; he has done many things and seen much, but even more he has
been an influential man, helping to shape the lives of hundreds of boys and young
men through his long years ol association with the Boy Scouts of America. Indeed
my own memories of this man go back over twenty years to a period when the
barriers of segregation were just beginning to break down. I still recall Mr
Pinchbeck and his Lumbee scout troop coming to various jamborees and
camporees and showing the rest of us what scouting was all about. Inevitably they
were the best all-around troop present, excelling at everything from knot-tying to
first aid. Moreover, Mr. Pinchbeck and his troop won the admiration, respect,
and friendship of all wherever they went. No one who knows Walter Pinchbeck
could ever accept his description of himself-he is an uncommon man educated in
the ways of the world-an exceptional man who need never apologize
DKE: Mr. Pinchbeck, vou’re not from this area originally. Would you tell r
WALTER PINCHBECK
(Photo by PSU Information Service)
little bit about yourself?
I was born in 1904 in Missoula, Montana, in a freight wagon. My Daddy
was a full-blooded Cree. He didn't want to live on a reservation-life on a
reservation was tough-and so he became a blacksmith. My Mother was also
a full-blooded Cree.
You know, it’s the darndest thing. A few years ago I was talking with this
fellow Norman Macleod-he teaches English here at the college-and learned
that he was in Missoula during the same years I was. We never met there,
but isn’t it something that over sixty years later we both ended up in
Pembroke.
But to get back to my story, when I was about six or seven my daddy
decided that I should go to school. He didn’t have any education but thought I
should. He sent me to a Catholic boarding school in Missoula. There were
about one hundred white students there and me. At the time I couldn’t speak
English, had to learn. No one there liked me because 1 was an Indian, except
for one little girl. There was one little girl who was nice to me, a pretty little
girl. At night I would cry because I was homesick and that little girl would
come and crawl in bed with me and put her arms around me to get me to
stop crying. I was about seven at the time. I’ve often wondered what
happened to that girl, she's probably a grandmother somewhere. I stayed at
that school until I was about eleven and then left to hobo over the country.
Hoboed as far south as the Gulf of Mexico and then back north again. Went
where the climate suited my clothes and pocketbook. During that time I
decided to become a professional hobo. A fellow told me that if I was going to
be a professional, I ought to put some money in a bank so I’d always have
something to fall back on if 1 needed it. I did that-put a little money in
several banks and it did come in handy later. As a hobo I always followed the
flight of the geese-when they went south, I went south, and when they went
north, I went north. Didn’t pay any attention to the flight of ducks cause
ducks don’t have any sense.
DKE: While hoboing gave you a chance to see much of the country and meet
many different people, you still had to live. You told me once that you’d
worked at many different jobs in your life. What kind of jobs have you had?
WP: You’re right. I’ve had all kinds of jobs. You know when you’re traveling
around it’s important, when you go look for work, to claim to be a
professional regardless of the job-doesn’t matter whether you’re going to
work in a man’s garden or break wild horses-you get the job if you can
convince the man you’re a professional. 1 once took part in the Calgary
Stampede-a big rodeo in Canada-and came within a few seconds of winning
big money by riding a wild horse-what they call bronco busting in western
rodeos-but me and that horse parted company before I could do it. I’ve been
a big game guide in Canada. Killed a couple of grizzlies who got in my way. I
can remember taking parties of hunters out for twenty dollars a day. Took
one English aristocrat out who was an interesting fellow. He was an
excellent shot so long as he was shooting at a target but he always got “buck
fever ’-shooklikealeaf inahigh wind-when he aimed at a live target. He’d
shoot and shoot and wouldn’t hit nothing. Scared all the game for miles
around just blasting away. Finally solved the problem by getting behind him
and killing the animals for him. He went home a “successful” big game
hunter with antlers and everything but I don’t believe he ever did hit
anything. I’ve also tried my hand at trapping and panning for gold-both are
hard ways to make a living.
DKE: I seem to recall that you told me once you’d even tried your hand at
boxing.
WP: Hey, your memory is good. In the late I920’s I was working at a loggin
camp in Washington. It was tough work with tough men. Doing that kind of
work you just naturally stay in shape. One of the ways we killed time when
we were off was by boxing. I was light-135-138 pounds-but I could beat
anybody in that camp. One day we went to Seattle. Went to a gym to work
out. Fellow came over and asked me if I wanted to spar some. Got in.the ring
and this guy said don’t hit too hard. Let’s just mess around. Well, I don’t pull
no punches. He left himself open and I knocked him out. Then another guy
came up and said he wanted to try me. And the same thing. Then this fellow
came over and said the Pacific Coast Lightweight Champ was looking for a
sparring partner. He said the champ wants to work out with you and would
pay $25.00 per round. I watched him for a few minutes and knew he was good
but he looked like he had a tendency to get careless, so I agreed. Thought I’d
see what I could do. So help me gosh, I caught him on his weak point. H
dropped his guard a little and I got him. I jabbed him with a left and hit him
with a right and spun him around and hit him again, I knocked him down
twice that day but he finally knocked me out. I never knew how he did it but
he did. Guess that’s why he was the champ. When I went into the service I
continued to fight. Fought across the Pacific to Manila where this mixed
Oriental-he was part Filipino, Chinese, Japanese and I don’t know what
ail-knocked me out. Never felt so bad in my life as from being knocked out
that time. That’s when I decided to quit boxing, after that mixed fellow did
me in.
DKE: Obviously you tried your hand at a number of things during your hoboing
career but does any one episode stand out in your mind, any one incident
that you recall more vividly than others?
WP: Well, actually there’re a couple of things that I especially remember. I
was once in a train wreck in the Rocky Mountains. I said to myself before it
happened that the engineer was drunk, crazy, or blind because he was going
way too fast for these mountains. That’s something you learn if you hobo
Page 7, The Carolina Indion Voice
WP;
long enough-when a train is beirfg run fig>it. Well, hg hit a curve and didn’t
make it. I was in a boxcar that' rolled three times. There was me, a
Frenchman, and a Irishman. The other two tried to get out and got messed
up-I stayed in and survived.
But you know the toughest spot I’ve ever been in was jury duty. I was the
only one on the jury that could read. It was a case where one Indian had
killed another Indian, using a .30 caliber Winchester, We could have
acquitted that fellow if he had.shot him from the front but he’d shot him from
the back. Used a soft-nose bullet-made a small hole in the back but a mighty
big one in the front. Darned if that fellow didn’t then carry his victim a
hundred miles to try and save him. Didn’t work. We had to convict him and
he was hung. This was up in British Columbia in Canada. 1 sure didn’t like
that business.
DKE: You didn’t spend all your life hoboing. What else did you do before yeq
came to Pembroke?
I’m coming to that. But first let me tell you one other story from my
hoboing days. I was traveling through Sasketchewan on the Canadian
Railroad “blind baggage.” That means I was riding between two baggage
cars. We pulled into town and stopped. I was just lazing away the time when
this policeman with a beard to his hips showed up and threw his forty-five in
my face. He said I was trespassing and to get off that damn train. All the
time he kept waving that thing in my face and so I reached out and grabbed
it. Darn thing didn’t even have a bullet in it. He then ordered me to go to jail,
and so I went, not having any place else in particular to go. We got there and
the door was locked and he couldn’t find the key. We broke into the jail with
an ax and I cleaned it up. I was sentenced to two weeks. It didn’t really turn
out to suit him, though it was fine with me-I had a roof over my head and he
had to feed me. After one week he wanted me to leave but 1 said I better
serve out my sentence. From then on that got to be a right sociable place. In
fact I took a job there when I left jail. When I finally left, it was just like I
came-on the train.
But you asked what else I did as a young man. In 1929 me and another
fellow joined the army in Salt Lake City, Utah. Both of us got sent to the
Philippines. During the trip over, our ship was caught in a storm-somebody
said it was a typhoon-whatever it was, that boat heaved here and there and
most everybody got sick. I sure was glad when we got off that boat.
I had a good time in the service. Got a chance to visit Formosa and
mainland China. I was given a twelve-hour pass in China but went AWOL for
two days. I wanted to see the Great Wall of China and so went. That thing
was built by slave labor and is 2500 miles long. They say that sick slaves
were killed and buried in it. Had my picture took there hugging a girl. Later
I visited Japan-jumped ship and got drunk as a “fiddler’s bitch.” Then on
the way back to the states, got in a barrom fight-that was more blessed fun.
My outfit finally got back to San Francisco in 1931. After we landed, the
army said all men who want to be discharged step forward. I stepped and
got out of the army with an honorable discharge.
DKE: When did you come to Pembroke?
WP: December 28, 1931. I remember it well. I’d been hoboing across the
country and just jumped off the train right in front of Old Main, a building of
Pembroke State University. The next morning I went into town and ate
breakfast. I asked if they served eggs and ham; they said yes and I said I’ll
take six eggs, six pieces of toast, and the biggest piece of ham you’ve got. All
that cost me 35 cents.
DKE: What made you decide to settle down here?
WP: Well, I’ll tell you. I stayed because of the people I found here. They were
Indians but weren’t like those elsewhere. .They had ingenuity and
ambition-they could compete against the white race-a tough people. But
that’s not the only reason I decided to stay. There used to be a little wooden
church here-a Holiness Church-and they had a big meeting there and I
went, I saw a girt there. I asked a fellow who she was and he told me her
name was Bertha Lowry. I told this guy you’re looking at my wife. He said
no, I want to marry her. I got myself introduced to her and though it took me
two years to land her, I finally did. We have three boys and three girls. I’ve
had a good life and a lot of fun,
DKE: How were Indians treated when you were traveling around the country
and what kind of reception did you get when you settled in Pembroke?
Continued on page 8
:AR0UNA INDIAN VOICE
YOUR "UP-TO-THE-MINUTE” GUIDE TO BUSINESS AND PROFESSIONAL SERVICE |
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TUSCARORA
INDIAN
HANDCRAFT SHOP
•Turquoise
•Leather Goods
•Bead Work
Tuscarora Craftsmen
2 Miles Northeast
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Niirht: 7.18-5404
I Years Kxt'crience
COMPLETE SEi.ECTION'
OF Fabrics
Grover Ixtcklear-Owner A ,
Fumlrure
^buildln9 ^ Upholstery
estimates given
521-4990 r
MOORE'S
CHAIN SAW
SERVICE
"Wu 5«rvkc What W» W
(Prospect School)
Phone 521 -9942
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THE CAROLINA
INDIAN VOICE
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VIOLA'S GRILL
Union Chapel Road
Pembroke. N.C.
521-934.6
T Traveling in Detroit 1
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Home Cooked Meals...
I 0 vegetables. Meal, teaS2.00
Specialing in
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CBITIFIED
LOCKSMITH
Keys Made
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INDIAN VOICE
521-2826
& KEY SERVICE
14632 MILLARD
MIDLOTHIAN, ILL. 60445
•HO^’r 'tl?) 3fiS-6192
Levi Honf, Jr., Owner
f or the latest hair sivics!
THAT CURL
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THUkSDAY NIGHT IS
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IxKated on Highway 710
521-9527
Glodys Moynor and
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Locks
Repaired
HUNT'S LOCK
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professional
CAR WASH
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Telephone 383-3666 I
3800 Furl Street T
Lincoln Park. Mich. T
48146 ♦
LOWRY'S
COUNTRY STORE
Now Selling Seed
At Wholesale Price!
•Complete line of seed and
All Kinds of Feed •Grocery
•Hardware and Notions
Joe Lowry, Proprietor
CALL 521-4026
Located on Red Banks Road
I.ess Than A Mile East
Of Prospect High School
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We wash it sparkling clean!
BLUE'S PIT
COOKED BAR B Q
For Carpentry. Masonrv
S2.00
Weekends
Open 6 am-11 pm
And All Kinds of
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I Chapel Road-Pcnibrokc
4-
Monday ihrough
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CALL 521-4720
earl C. JACOBS
Florist j
CMNtT WIN MllVpT
Flowers nietAr* '
1**ieiji Cerreel — lone' J
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Moynor's Exxon
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For Rrsf Closs Service
• WeSMTAL •
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1521-96391
LcKoled Of Intersecrion
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521-0578
Pembroke, N.C.
Horvey Revels and
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THECAROUNA
INMAN voice
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THE
CAROLINA
INDIAN VOICE i
521-2826 }
THE CAROLINA INDIAN VOICE
NEWSPAPER AND PRINT SHOP
521-2826
Classified Ads Rote
$1.50'first 25 words
5 cents eoch odditionol word
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TRenlal Fomials f Men-Crystal
♦ Rental Service nd Wedtjjng'
Decorations,
RUDY'S RESTAURANT T
Good Home Cooking T
: Open 5 a.m.-6 p.m. i
ispeciolizing in breokfost every morning, y
1 (Grits. Two Eggs, Sausage, Discuits) k
T S1.25 i
i FEATURING... T
.Chicken and Pastrv on Tue.sday and SalurdavA
Wednesday ' ' |
Spagbcffi and Meatballs Dinner % -i.OO ,4
Chicken and Rice on Ihursday. onl> $1.00I
MR. BUSINESSMAN:
THE CAROLINA
INDIAN VOICE
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