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ALEIGII AND North-Carolina State r Our fe '.. pl n$ of fait delightful Peace, Unwirp'd bf pirtyrife, to live like Brothers. THURSDAY, DECEMBER 14, 1S09. No. . 4. REG IS 1F7 P Jl A JFvX. R t XI. DOCUMENTS, WHICH MH'MPAMH) t UK yjss.iGE or rut: i'in:sivt:. i or the fNII'KI STA Tf'.S. It' .- .1-.' "r ru::uj".t -j f .f Oj. o r 5,,t Wa-aiirnn, Juh 31, 11.9. gg I hv.c t-c honor to enclose ; . ,nji cpy of an Order, which w -1 j.cdbv Im M ijety in Council, on tin :4..icf Si v bs b communicating this Order, it is ... deepest reg-et that I have to i-'"Tin )t i. Majesty has not ti tjj'-i piirt0 cur.fr m the lite pro r.sl a.Mtcintn; which 1 had enter e, ir '.j w.;h voti, on the part of our - vn-cive governments. ' Stiiher the present time, nor the oc CiS.-n, will afford me a favorable ,-ani:r for cxpbiiin.g t you tin - urdi and reasons, open which 1 con c had conformed t his Maj.styS r s, and tr the spin:, a Last, ol an j :iLt-:ur.s upon ht subject ; nor, in would av vindication ot my con- t, . . -r I n ir toonrri it o anv - hir licr than as it might rj :o h w ;hi r.o intenti n existed, t rr.v p. r , to practise ai.v den p t (jovtrninent cl the L'r. ed s i-firtich, however, to 4i -n'i i t tt th:t p.'i t of the v (1-f'rr. li h p" ttci" the com- and sh'j);)in ot ilr L'ni iil States it- n tnv mjary aiu mromeni nces we'i iiiiht hive ansen to Am- t ican i .i: :, toin a reiiaMce fifi tne provt s. i a'rcnir ru before r.utU'o' i'! ; iiiri cjtin : I'M cherish a. h", , h r L? "her hid cunstqut dccn m y r.u!l f.;nan arrat-i nunt, whi i 1 a l tul h Sc'i.viij wiu!d hive met with his M.j-v.)' upp: ohation, and wcultl hav Lu to a niplc'.c and cordial under j-j"1t; !k ween the two countries. VYr cn rnents of the highest con-sVrrii.-, I hic tile honor to be, Sir, 5 -r miv. o'cJ icut humble sen ant. " M. EHSKI.NE. K-'btrt Snuth, i.c. Tl: i! V-f . i - .V: i.'f .o .If-. F.r-h-.e. I) , jr. a .:.'. jf"?utt, A'i. 9, rno j le tic i , encScsii.j; a p-iireii r, f ; ur, c a printed .opy .1 ri c.'i e.j y . !i m Mr. C.u nn i: , airoi' o her thi''s, th i v : rrort ot our conversations M". M:.'is n. Mr. (iallatin, and i r. th ivriv an C nern 's ' v. !:. m i he v. r.t ol his s n.l to t hr'.r. .v , -fs nO nal 'd Jjiui.it y N iv: ni l.7i f withdraw conitmpoi ane V. ' :1 n irf ill.. i''!i.pr,i'tiiiii rS V u- 'u to 0 v.ar and all Nrr- au ! N .-Iu.i)f)r a ion Acts. a r.vnrr;s (.rial IJri ain. Irivu.c trtrn in f .(; wrh rtsjct to Franc a-'! Uic p rm which adopt or awl un Ctr h' c! -' rtrs. I h Trcrica is w);hr to rv-r.'unc-.f4- r - u,c prvkt.n. war lllL. p;... : n o! - . uvir - OM ,a timc 0f War. d tra!i xv. h ih- enemy's coionie v from Vr":h xduc'ed during pi ace. -d. "(irev-Hr t. Lr the iwrpo'. puriMse rt -.on; in . r.s'.iun f.f t'c l-.tiih ,i - 3r-J jj iiitcn'i'j.'i of A to Dit'.ent her ri i-.nc f tl.M - ii i 1 1 iv hi wrn lrur.ee and the iW- e r , t n t,rt -;cts, is to he considered as r" S 41 ,l-rty to cajturc all such A ,f ::rn vv.U, a may he lou-d a - c-r.,,;in uzt with the ports of anv r" I v.r rJ; u;:haa! ttim hscruii- .t'ie oVci Vance rf the Embar-S r.r " U r,um'n'ilJy wih respect to h ;l ,n u!on': would in fact raise to !! the world." V.... nt: acting ut.der the ..Tt he bonr to request y ju to fa- Slirh explamtions, as y i.r v-'.'V'' a! nC St,J?St;:1' 1,1 elation I : npu'cd convcrsati )i?s. so txincss to ou, Sir, the c f.'t ot i,c extraordinary '-rt foithm tin, Utter ot" in--n, -nd especially at the exp-cta--l tn.i :Ur .mcr.t would. ::s a ",,iry. rcrn-ze Conu'vions, two 1 u s-" C S 'y anJ 'Merest of the U 'm k tV??. l' ,mwcvcr Wtuld ie--"c c' .V T,J dnd it pr per to t lie President i have perceived in its j Th-t every opinion which he enter condihons or in ts spin1, that concilia- taint.il respecting the best intcres's of lory d'Sfosi ion.vhicli had been protvss- cd, and liicli, it was hoped, hid real ly ex t. d. I h.ivc the honor to be, Stc. 11. SMITH. Ihc II n I). M. Krnki:;.-, ?kC 7 on .1-. Erxkiht lo .'. S .u:h. Wu-i.jimon, A :irust 14t!i, 18D9. Sir I liave the hor.oi to acknou ledge he rtcrip' (i your l-.-ttei of the 9th in 1 -i.it, iniormini; me that you had just cicd a letter frrr. Mr. Finkney, closing a prin.d j.aper, p'iTportin to c a printed copy of a dispatch to me tr.Tin Mr. Canning, which states, amor other thini5, iiom the report of your conversations with Mr. Madison, Mr. Gallatin aud Mr. Smith, it appears 1st. 'Ft'.at the Anitiican Govern ment is prepared, in the event of his Mjjc sty's cntjvctiiin to withdraw the )iilcrs in Council of January and No vember, 1S07, to withdraw contempera- ! UlousIv, on us par, t he interdiction of j its harbors to ships of v. ar, aid t il non- j Imeitouie antl Nun r.npoi aii-in Acts, so far as te spec's Grea?-IJpiain, leaving , hem in fo:eo with rts; cct to rrar.ee ; :nd the powers which adopt, or act u:i- j ItT hr r Dt creei. ' 11 -d. That America is willinj; to re- , iiour.ee, dii'i.ur the piescut uai, tfie I pretension ot cait)inr; on, in time ot war, a!l trade with the enemy's colo nics, from which she was excluded du ring peace. 11 3dly. (Weat-Hritain, for the pur pose of securing th:- operation of the l.n.naiiro, and the bona f.i' intention of Ameiieato prevent hei uii-.ns frjm i.tdinj wi'.li France and the- powers a dopiiii ind acting under the Frer.cn Dei rres, i to be con ddercd cs bein a liberty to capture all such American t sels as mav be fo'jnd at'etnuiinir f o trade with th.- prts of any elf these I powers ; without !:: h icetirity f f the he' vance i f t!.e FmOanro, the ra in nominally with respect to (jrca-liri-.on alone, Wfu!d, in fac, it with respect to all the wot Id." The explanations which yen.; request from me upon that subject shall be i ven with candor, and I will proceed, ac Cfv.iMr.'y, to by before you un abstract of thu commur.i; ati'ns which I mud to his Maj-jsty's tovt rr.rnent relative t the unoniial conversations w liich I had ; n Jd with Mr. Madison (hen Secretary f State) Mr. Gallatin antl yourself, at '.tie timr and upon the occasion alluded to hv his Majesty's Secretary of State (Mr. Canning) in that part of his in ttu lions to me of which you inform m you have iec ived a printed copy horn Mr. Finkney. Upon referring to my desnatches ad dressed to hi- Majesty's t"Vtrnment ol I the 3.1 an.! tth Decimbet last, in which tiiese C'inHoiiinicaiions are detailed, I onclude tha the con rs..tious alludco 'o must have bei.n held some days pre vious to that period, and were to the !";!! owim; effect : Mr. Mulison (then Secretary of State) : represented by me to have ured va rious arguments tending to prove tha' h- United States hatl txerted all their efl irts to persuade the Flench govern. hment to withdraw their unjust restric tions upon neutiul commerce, and that recourse mi;!u have been had to mea- suiestif more acliviry and decision a- .inst F ance than mere rernonstran-;ce-s but that, in the mgn time Grea- Hiilaiu had issued her Orders ir Coun cil, before it was known whether the U. States would acquiesce in the aggies- , sions of France, and thereby rd dercd j it impossible to distinguish between the i j conduct of the two belligerents, who, I had eq ially committed aggressions a- i ! gainst the U. S'ates. . After so nc other observations, Mr. : ! Madison is stau d by me- fit that time to jhavt: addctl, that as the world must bt convinced that America had in vain ta ! ken all the nv-ans in her power to ob tain fiom G. Hiita n and France a jut a, en ion to her rights us a neutral p w- ,cr by reprtsentaAi.)ns and remonstran ces, that she w u!d b; fully justified in havinj? recourse to hostilities wi'h either i belligerent, and that she only hesitated ' 'o do so fiom the difTtculty of contend ing with both; but that she must be dnven even to endeavor to maintain her rights against the two greatest powers ! ,:in the woild; unless either of them j .should relax their restrictions upon neu-' 'tral conmcrce : t:. which case, the U. btatts would at once side with that power against the other which might coniinuc its aggressions. his country led him t wish that a good i understanding thould lake place be tween Great-Hriiain and the U. States, I nd that he thought that the obvious advantages which would thereby result to both countries were a sufficient pledge of ihe sincerity of his sen'iments. These observations, Sir, I b. g leave to remark, were made to me by Mr. Madison about a month alter the mtel 1 genre had been received in this coun try of t he rejection by his M.ijesty's go vernment of the'proposition made thro' Mr. Finkney by the Fresident for the removal of t lie embargo as respected G. Ihit iin, upen condition that the Orders ;n Council should be withdrawn as res pe ted the United States : and his sen- iments were, as I conceived, express ed to me. in order that I might convey i hem to his Majesty's government, so as to lead to a reconsideration of the proposition hove m ntioned with a view j lo die adjustment of the differences u- j that su!)iect between the respective1 ountries. Fut 1 never considered that i Mr. Madison meant that the govern-J mot of the United States would pledge j themselves beyond ihe proposition res-! peeling ihe embargo, as abovej stated ! because that WjS the extent of i the pow er of the Fresident by tne Constitution' oi" the U. S ate.. ' I understood, verv distinctly that ihc observations of the Secretary of State were intended to convey an opinion as o what ought and would be ihe course pursuerl hy the U. rtatcs, in the event of his Majesty's Orders in Council be ing wnhdrawn. In these sentiments and opinions, you concurred. a I codected from the tenor t several conversations which I held with you at that period. With respect to the second point, as stated in your letter to be contained in a " Despatch from M' . Canning, I beg leave to offer ihc following explanation : In the course of a private interview I had with Mr. Gallatin ( he Secretary of the Treasury) he intimated that the non-intercourse law which was then likely to be passed by the Congress, might be considered as removing two very impottant grounds of difference wirfi Great-Bii'-ain, viz. the non-importation act, as applicable to her alone, and also the Fr sidmt's proclamation, whereby the ships of Greai-Hriiain were excluded from the por's of the United States, while those of France were per mitted to' enter but that by the non-in tei course law, both powers were placed on ihc same fooling. did not pre- end to say that this measure had been aken from any motives of concession to Great-Britain ; but as, in fact, those consequences fallowed, he conceived ihcy might be considered as removing the two great obstacles to a conciliation, lie adverted also ta the probability of an adjustment ot another important! point in dispute between the two coun- J lies, as he said that he knew that it vas intended by the United States to a bandon the attempt to carry on a trade with the colonies of belligerents in the; lime of war, which was not allowed in the time of peace, 8c to trust to the being permitted by the French ta carry on such trade in peace, so- as to entitle hern to a continuance of it in time of j war. And it may be very material to ascer tain what " trade with the colonies of j belligerents" was, in my conception, j meant by Mr. Gallatin, as intended io be abandoned by the United S'ates, I feel no hesitation in declaring, that I suppos ed he alluded to the trade from the co-lonh-s of belligerents direct from their mother country, or to the ports of other belligerents, because the rignt to such trade had beeri the point in dispute whereas, the right to carry on a trade from the colonic! of belligerents to the United States had never been called in question, and had. been recognized by His Majesty's Supreme Court of Admi ralty ; and the terms even upon which such colonial produce might be re-exported from the United States had been formerly arranged in a treaty signed in London by the Minister's Plenipotentia ry of both countries, which was not in deed ratified by the President of the U. States ; but was not objected to as to that article of it which settled the terms up on which such trade was to be permit ted. Such vf as the substance, sir, of the unofficial conveisations which I had held with Mr. Madison, Mr GiUatin, and yourself, which I did not 'consider or rep. jj resent to His Majesty's government as. , intended with any other view than to endeavor to bring about therepeal ol the Orders in Council by shewing that many ol the obstacles which had stood in the way of an amicable adjustment of the differences between the two coun tries were already removed, and that a fair prospect existed of settling what re mained ; since the United States had exhibited a determination to resist the unjust aggressions upon her neutral rights, which vvs all that Great Britain had-.ever required ; but I certainly ne ver rceived any assurances from the A merican government that they would pledge themselves to adopt the condi tions specified in Mr. Canning's instruc tions as preliminaries ; nor did, I ever hold out such an expectation to His M a jesty's government ; having always stag ed to them that in ihe event oF his Ma jesty's thinking it just or expedient to ;ause his Orders in Council to'be with drawn that the President would take off the Embargo as respected England, leaving at in operation against France and the powers which adopted, or acted under her decrees according to the au thority yhich was vested in him at, that time by; the Congress of the U. States, and that there was every reasdn to ex pect that a satisfactory arrangement might be made upon the points of the colonial trade which had been sp long in dispute betweeu the two countries. As to the third condition referred to by you,' specified in Mr. Canning's in structions, 1 have only to remaik, that I never held any conversation with the members of the government of the U. States, relative to it,, umil my late negotiation- oi had ever mentioned jthe sub ject to His Majesty's government it having for the first time, been present ed to my consideration in Mr. Canning's despatch to me of the 23d of January, in which that idea is suggested, a!nd is 1 stated to have been assented to by Mr. : Finkney. It would be unavailing, at the present moment, io enter upon an examination of the f pretensions set forth : in Mr. j Canning's letter of instructions' (which you are pleased to term) " ex'.raojdi.riai y," I consider it however, to be my duty to declare that, during my negociation .with you which led to the conclusion of the provisional agreement, I found no reason to believe that any d'fnculties would occur in the accomplishment of the two "former conditions, as far as it was in the power of the President of the Uuiied. States to accede to the first, and consistently with the explanation which I rnve before given of the second point : Oi; the contrary, I received assuran ces through you, that ibje President would comply (as far as it was in his power) with the first condition, and that there could be no doubt that the Con gress would think it inciAnbeDt upon them to; assert the rights of the; United ; States against such powers as should a-! dopt or act under the decrees; cF r ranee a.s soon as their actual conduct dr deter minations upon that subject could be as certained but that, in the me:ah time, the Fresident had not the power and could not undertake to pledge himself in the formal manner required to that ef. feet. I received also assurances frohvyou, that no doubt could be reasonably enter tained that a satisfactoiy arrangement might be made in a treaty upon the sub ject of the second condition mentioned in Mr.Canning's ins ructions, according to my explanations of it in the foregoing ! part of this letter, but that it necessarily would fprm an article of a treaty in which the various pretensions of the two countries should be settled. The third condition you certainly, ve ry distinctly informed me could: not be recognized by the President, but you ad ded what had great weight in my mind, that you did not see why an? grieat im portance should be attached io such a recognition ; because it would he im possible that a citizen of the LH States could prefer a complaint to his govern ment oiv jaccoitnt of the" capture of his vessel while engaged in a trade absolute ly interdicted by the laws of his country. Under these circumstances, therefore, finding that I could not obtain the re cognitions specified m Mr Canning s despatch of the 23d of January(which formed but on: part of his instructions to me) in the formal mannerrequired, I considered that it would be in vain to lay before the government of thetUnited States the dispatch in question, which I was &t liberty lo have done in exten so, had thought proper. But as I haa !;ucs to g Mounds fc believirg hat the object of his M jrsty's govcrnrAent ould be -attained, though in a different manner, and the spirit, at least, of my several letters of instructions -be fully complied with, I felt a thorough co: vie lion-upon my mind that I should be acting in conformity with his Majesty's wishes;' and, accordingly, concluded the late provisional agreement in his Ma jesty's behalf with the government of ther United States. i ' ' ' The disavowal by his Majesty is painful proof to me that I had formed an erroneous judgment of hF. Majesty's views and the intention of 'my instruct tions ; and I have most severely io la ment thkt an act of mine ((.hough unin tentional) should produce any embar rassments in the relations between the two countries. - - j It is a great consolation to me, how ever, io perceive that measures have ben adopted by both governments, to prtvent any losses and to obviate any inconveniencies which mighi have alrU sen to the citize ns or subjects' of either country from a reliance cn the fulfil ment of that provisional agreement, and I cannot but cherish a hope, tru-t a com plete and cordial understanding between; the two countries may be effec ed I beg leave to add that it would have given me :great happiness to h ye con tributed to so desirable an object, anct to offer you the assurances of the greaC respect and high consideration wiifo which I remain, Sir, your obedient ser vanr. D. M. EKSKiNE. The Hon. R. Smith &c. The Secretary of the Treasury to Mr. Erskinsi Washington, Aug.' 13, 1809. SIR I do not believe, tha in the conveisations we ha'e had respecting che practicability of an adjustment of the difiV.ences between the U. States and Greai-Bntain, we ever have misun derstood one another.) Vet as from Mr Canning's instructions lately pu lished by your government, It would seenvihat some opinions5 are ascribed to several members of this administration, whicH' they did not entertain, it appears, nectsv saiy to ascertaji; whether on any point a misapprehension can have taken placed I will forbear making any observa tions on what in the instructions is call ed the third condition, since it is not as serted tha1 that inadmissible pncrposi tion was suggested at Washington. The points embraced in M. Can nirig's first proposition f. rmcd the prin cipal topic ol our conversations, relative to a revocation of the Orders in. Coun cil. Yet in the manner in which that proposifon is expiess-d, it goes further than had be.n suggested by the merfp be i s of the administration It is suffi ciently evident from the proceedings of Congress, both previous and subsequent to the unratified ag cement of April las', that the United States intended to continue the restrictions- orr the com mercial intercourse with France, whilst such of her decrees as violated' "ur ncu tral rights continued in force, and to re move those restrictions in relation to G.. Britain, in the event of a revocation of the Orders in C- unci!. But that state of things so far as it related to France was to result from our own laws known or anticipated by your g' rnmejltwheni ' ihey authorised an ar a gement ; and it was not proposed by us that the con tinuance of the non-intercourse wiihv France should be made a condition of that' arrangement. Whilst on that sub ject, It will add an observation, though perhaps not immediately connected withi the object of this letler. 1 think hat the obj ct o.f that proposition so far as it agreed wichyour pri-vic us ut derstand-. ingof the intentions of this government, has been substantially earned into effect on our part. It U true that your go vernment miht at the d3te of the in- I structions have expected from the inci V pient proceedings of -Congress, that Holland would be embraced by the re strictive laws of the Uned States. Not only however was the omission nomi nal, since American vessels wers, at the time, by the decrees of that Country re fused admission into its poit; but un der the same construction of our laws by which the commercial intercourse with Holland was permitted, 'that with . Portugal was also considered as legal itr the event of that eou try being oceupi-' ed by British troops in the naineof ;ho Prince Regent. It is therefore principally as respects the second condition which relates to the colonial tracfe, that erroneous" infr Tes might bt drawn from the expressions
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